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Controversial Article:Autopilot definition

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B@TMAN

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PostSubject: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:47 pm#1

1.Definition of Autopilot
2.Examples of Autopilot
3. The Problem with the Current Definition
4. Rewriting the definition in Yugioh Context.



1.Definition of Autopilot:
The definition autopilot in the Yugioh community is a deck that never uses skill to use but the deck runs itself or runs on autopilot. The term is mainly used due to the deck in question being rather easy to play or self explanatory, rather and doesn't require a great deal of skill or thought.

2. Examples of Autopilot deck:
go to google and find dragon ruler blueprint or any deck blueprint and basically that is an example of a autopilot deck.
Decks that were considered autopilot decks:
Dragon Rulers
Prophecy
tellarknight
Qliphorts....etc
Most of the time the term is used to argue against any tier 1 or meta deck that is topping at that time to explain that deck takes no skill to use and the deck runs itself.

3.The Problem withe ]Current Definition
The big problem with this definition is that there is no legit definition or any actual definition you can pull from a yugioh website that everyone agrees with. Another issue with the definition is that every deck to some degree is figured out and mentioned as "staple move" or common move meaning to some degree it takes no skill.
This is a quote i found to explain this side to the best degree.

Code:select content

Code:
Assuming that you initially disregard individual player skill due to the fact
that all of them have plateaued and know their plays/decks, any deck
with one such player as a pilot will play itself, especially in a
mirror.
 "Once you're really, really good at TeleDAD, every hand plays itself
and it gets boring as hell." Emphasis being on the words "Once you're
really, really good at TeleDAD


4. Rewriting the Definition in Yugioh Context.
The term needs to be rewritten if people are still going to use the term in some sense or a logical definition needs to be made. I found people use it as an excuse to defend their view against meta to say it takes no skill but to some degree, every deck takes effort to know and understand. people do test decks and run prototype builds.
If not, the term shouldn't technically exist if there is no proper definition.

My experience with auto-pilot:
i used decks that might use some sort of auto-pilot moves(synchrons using junk and doppel warrior combo, madolche using jelly and level 3 monster, tellarknights to make their rank 4s,.....bascially i used most decks considered auto-pilot.). While i agree that the term does match with those kind of decks, i do make the argument that there is no such thing as auto-pilot for selected few decks when it should be applied to all decks because every deck has a manual or an auto-pilot move you can make similar to how in yugioh structure decks, they would make this small guide on to how to use the deck. My point is either consider every deck to be its own auto-pilot manual no matter the length of the manual or consider dropping the term because every deck has some sort of auto-pilot part of it.

does skill become hidden in auto-pilot decks?
well if you think the term exists, then let me ask this? if you know how to fly an actual plane, do you really need to rely on a manual? no because you know full well how to fly it. Same logic applies here in which decks that are auto-pilot do not rely on the person using the deck which is incorrect. You still need to know how to use the deck in cases where your hand is decent to just plain awful.
Some of the decks do take skill because you still need to do the moves to make those moves from the autopilot decks.
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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Fri Aug 14, 2015 10:04 pm#2

B wrote:
Most of the time the term is used to argue against any tier 1 or meta deck that is topping at that time to explain that deck takes no skill to use and the deck runs itself.
That's not true. There were a lot of decks, which were topping without being called "auto-pilot". For example - Burning Abyss and Shaddolls. In a mirror match with those decks, just a Small missplay would cost you the game and even the most skilled players can missplay in some situations.

The quote you posted is true, but.. First you have to learn how to play that deck, which decisions are the best at the current situation and other things. Not like Tellarknights for Example. There is nothing to learn. You just go for a Vega, summon Altair and get Deneb from Grave, then go into some XYZ/summon Unuk, send Deneb to the graveyard and then either you have Altair in your hand to summon Deneb, or you have a set "Call of the Haunted" or "Oasis of Dragon Souls" and then just set all Trap cards in your hand. A couple of missplays here might not even affect the game. It's all about Luck in a Tellar Match-up. The only skill that deck takes, is to decide into which XYZ you have to go. With other words, auto-pilot deck. If you tell me a different Start for the game, other than summoning Deneb/Unuk and setting a lot of backrows, I would be impressed.

Same goes for:
Quote :
well if you think the term exists, then let me ask this? if you know how to fly an actual plane, do you really need to rely on a manual? no because you know full well how to fly it.

Very poor said. First you have to actually LEARN how to fly with that plane. There is no auto-pilot to press every button for you, which is not right for some archetypes.

Quote :
Decks that were considered autopilot decks:
Dragon Rulers
Dragon Rulers were never considered as an Auto-pilot deck. The archetype was bad and the format was the worst, but it actually took some skill to win a Dragon Rulers Match-up. A missplay in such a match can cost you the game for sure.

When I came back after 3, almost 4 years of retirement, I tried everything that was called Meta. Satellarknights, Burning Abyss, Shaddolls, Nekroz and Qliphorts. It took me a lot of games to learn how to play Burning Abyss, Shaddolls and Nekroz. I used to missplay a lot in the start and I still do, rarely but I do. But Satellar or Qliphorts? Nope. I just went as good with them as every skilled player who was playing them.

I would say Yu-Gi-Oh is almost all about luck nowdays. It's not as fun as it used to be and skill doesn't really matters.

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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Sat Aug 15, 2015 10:31 am#3

In my opinion, the phrase 'auto-pilot' is just a term used to help swallow a defeat or bandage wounded pride.

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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Sat Aug 15, 2015 10:42 am#4

definition i got from Mr.Google

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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Sat Aug 15, 2015 2:02 pm#5

There is no auto pilot decks in YGO. There simply as 'strong' decks that might still win even if the user mess up A LOT. But that doesn't mean they're skill-less or anything. Heck some people used to say Dragon Rulers are auto piloted yet if you watch the duels of a new user of them and a skillful user.. you'll see the differences and that's based on every single other deck out there. 

YGO is a fast game that always updates into newer things, some might not have the ability to keep up with things therefore creating the term of "Auto-Pilot" 

Note: Not trying to disrespect anyone. I'm just commenting with how I see it D=

Anyways, thank you for posting such a thread B@TMAN, it sure is a new discussion we have on the academy.

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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Sat Aug 15, 2015 2:09 pm#6

As I said, what skill does Satellars take? Except maybe for choosing what XYZ to summon. There are just some decks, which doesn't need any practice or learning, they just do everything for you and that's why they are called "auto-pilot". Don't know if I should repeat myself, but Satellars.. You summon Deneb, get Altair and set 4 Traps. What can you do wrong here?
If you just can't missplay with a deck, it's "Auto-pilot".

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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Sat Aug 15, 2015 3:11 pm#7

@Shadow ϟ wrote:
As I said, what skill does Satellars take? Except maybe for choosing what XYZ to summon. There are just some decks, which doesn't need any practice or learning, they just do everything for you and that's why they are called "auto-pilot". Don't know if I should repeat myself, but Satellars.. You summon Deneb, get Altair and set 4 Traps. What can you do wrong here?
If you just can't missplay with a deck, it's "Auto-pilot".


Give a bad player that deck and watch what he do. Give it to a good player and you'll see the difference.

Tellarknights still need the knowledge of each card effect, rulings and what to do and when to do. Without these, a player WILL misplay and lead to his losing. Therefore the deck for sure needs 'Skills'. 

That's how I see it D: 


I hat Burning Abyss, I personally always lose when I use them while they're a deck that just win. I still lose, why? I'm simply bad at them. Same goes for Nekroz. I guess I sucked so hard in this format meta!

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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Sat Aug 15, 2015 6:08 pm#8

@RsS wrote:
@Shadow ϟ wrote:
As I said, what skill does Satellars take? Except maybe for choosing what XYZ to summon. There are just some decks, which doesn't need any practice or learning, they just do everything for you and that's why they are called "auto-pilot". Don't know if I should repeat myself, but Satellars.. You summon Deneb, get Altair and set 4 Traps. What can you do wrong here?
If you just can't missplay with a deck, it's "Auto-pilot".


Give a bad player that deck and watch what he do. Give it to a good player and you'll see the difference.

Tellarknights still need the knowledge of each card effect, rulings and what to do and when to do. Without these, a player WILL misplay and lead to his losing. Therefore the deck for sure needs 'Skills'. 

That's how I see it D: 


I hat Burning Abyss, I personally always lose when I use them while they're a deck that just win. I still lose, why? I'm simply bad at them. Same goes for Nekroz. I guess I sucked so hard in this format meta!
Wait, wait, you are talking about Player's skill in general and wh
e are not discussing that. If you give Tellarknights to a bad player at the start, he will missplay while the good won't, but if you give Burning abyss to a bad player and skilled one, they will both missplay at the start.

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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Sat Aug 15, 2015 10:06 pm#9

Why is this even a discussion in the first place? Every deck requires skill to play well. That's what it boils down to. You can have a discussion on linearity based on how many decision trees you encounter, but even the most linear decks require you to know how the game works, how to play those decks to maximum effect (for god's sake, the AI's on YGOPro should be evidence of this), and knowledge of how other decks work so you can have a gameplan against those.

By extension, a deck cannot be fully autopilot, as you still have to actually play out the hands. Suggesting that a deck is autopilot fails to account for player skill and player error, among other things. If anything, my experience suggests that people use autopilot as a slur to degrade people who play decks they don't like, as opposed to using it as a term that generates real conversation on the design problems of cards.

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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Sun Aug 16, 2015 1:23 am#10

Everyone tends to say the same things in these types of things. I agree mostly with Argor, but I do have another point to bring to the table: sometimes Konami just goes too far. Even a bad Dragon Ruler player a few formats ago could plus immensely with Super Rejuvenation. Just randomly using the baby and adult effects of the dragons could net you a substantial advantage in the game.

A player in that format using a Dragon Ruler deck had a stronger chance against any other deck, regardless of any skill factors. Dragon Ruler format was so bad that even Prophecy, with their insane draw power, was also easily outmatched, even by bad players with the mot basic understanding of the game.

Sure, a good Dragon Ruler player could just as well win against such a bad player using the same deck, but in terms of Tier 0 decks, I like to think that's where the term is applicable. Not every Tier 0 deck fits that description, though. I would argue that the Frog FTK, for example, actually required a real understanding of the game. You could argue that about many FTKs that required a bit of forethought, such as the Gusto-Mind Master deck.

It does exist to some degree, but people throw the term around so much that whatever meaning it did have is long-lost.

The prime example of autopiloting in YGO, if you ask me, is using the Yata-lock.

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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Sun Aug 16, 2015 4:17 am#11

good to know i got alot of comments on this. so tell me what you guys think of it?
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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Mon Aug 17, 2015 11:56 am#12

Calling a deck autopilot is a dismissive excuse for one's own shortcomings. All players, no matter how good they are, or how well they prepare their decks, can lose any given matchup. People develop a distinct dislike for a deck that they can't consistently beat, and that deck becomes "autopilot". This whole discussion is bollocks. If you're going to play the game, you have to accept the fact that you will lose, and your loss won't always be fair and logical.

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PostSubject: Re: Controversial Article:Autopilot definition Mon Aug 17, 2015 4:48 pm#13

agreed. the fact people blame the opponents deck is an excuse. there is an element of luck to every game. one thing about probability "nothing is ever 100%".
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